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Re: Chou Lee [message #38138 is a reply to message #399 ] Fri, 01 May 2009 14:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bladedancer is currently offline Bladedancer
Messages: 1160
Registered: January 2005
Location: Tennessee
Moderation is one of the components of Taoist living. Mostly to ensure you have a decent balance in terms of your body and your health.

"...or I swear by my pretty floral bonnet that I will end you." Captain Malcolm Reynolds, Firefly.

My LJ name is poetheather. Come, read, enjoy?
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38179 is a reply to message #38108 ] Fri, 01 May 2009 20:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James K is currently offline James K
Messages: 529
Registered: January 2009
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Violet, MitchellTF: To me, evil is doing something that has bad outcomes if it works. Misguided good intentions is doing something that would have good outcomes if it worked, but it doesn't work. Since I consider both to be moral failings (the failing in the latter case is not thinking hard enough about what you are going to do), I don't worry too much about a clear divivsde between them.

I also agree that selfishness can be taken to far. Greed is neither good nor bad in itself, its the context of it that matters.

I also agree that the principles I outlined above are at odds with medical autonomy. While interfering with someone's rights is harming them, it may be the lesser harm in some cases. Sometimes the end does justify the means.

First Lesson: Every princess needs a battleaxe
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38185 is a reply to message #399 ] Fri, 01 May 2009 21:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MitchellTF is currently offline MitchellTF
Messages: 484
Registered: January 2009
Ah, but James K...how do you define 'Bad outcomes'?

http://www.msfhigh.com
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38209 is a reply to message #38185 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 00:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Faraway is currently offline Faraway
Messages: 1105
Registered: January 2009
Location: Russia
Planned bad outcome: You hire an assassin to assassinate a researcher whose work could revolutionalise the energy acquisition/consumption. It works.
Misguided good intention: Friend of that researcher publishes his work, but that work is missing an essential part researcher knew about but failed to put in before his untimely death. Global scale economics are put in a great crisis.
What if: Assassination plot did not work? The part would have been put in the work, the work would be published and implemented, and suddenly Earth became a near-unlimited supply of energy. Wars for resources are no longer needed.

Never mind, I'm just a guy.

Eldritch: “Details, details, no pokey the cranky bitch.”
Bladedancer: “But Hekate’s not here!”
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38210 is a reply to message #399 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 00:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MitchellTF is currently offline MitchellTF
Messages: 484
Registered: January 2009
By what standard is 'Wars for resources ceasing' or 'unlimited energy' bad?

http://www.msfhigh.com
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38213 is a reply to message #38210 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 01:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Faraway is currently offline Faraway
Messages: 1105
Registered: January 2009
Location: Russia
I thought it would be obvious that it was an example of something good. I hope now it is.

Never mind, I'm just a guy.

Eldritch: “Details, details, no pokey the cranky bitch.”
Bladedancer: “But Hekate’s not here!”
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38231 is a reply to message #399 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 12:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MitchellTF is currently offline MitchellTF
Messages: 484
Registered: January 2009
Sorry, good. Agh.

*rubs head* I keep misspeaking. A lot. I meant my question to be rhetorical.

"By what standard is 'war ceasing' good?"

http://www.msfhigh.com
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38233 is a reply to message #38116 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 12:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Geminii is currently offline Geminii
Messages: 126
Registered: November 2008
Location: Australia
Sir Lee wrote on Fri, 01 May 2009 20:12

People figure out better ways to do stuff not because they wish to better the lives of their fellow men, but because they don't want to do it the hard way anymore.


Very true.

They also figure out stuff because:

- they like figuring things out in general
- they like demonstrating how much smarter they are than everyone else
- they're irritated with the inefficient way that something is currently being done, for any number of reasons
- they approach a problem from first principles and accidentally/incidentally come up with a better way, sometimes because the playing field has changed or more/better supporting technologies have become available since the last time someone worked out the best way of doing it
- they figure there might be a buck in it
- they're bored
- they're determined to succeed, for selfish or altruistic reasons
- lots of other possibilities
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38237 is a reply to message #38233 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 13:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Diane Castle is currently offline Diane Castle
Messages: 2505
Registered: September 2007
Location: Oregon, USA
Geminii wrote on Sat, 02 May 2009 09:52

Sir Lee wrote on Fri, 01 May 2009 20:12

People figure out better ways to do stuff not because they wish to better the lives of their fellow men, but because they don't want to do it the hard way anymore.


Very true.

They also figure out stuff because:

- they like figuring things out in general
- they like demonstrating how much smarter they are than everyone else
- they're irritated with the inefficient way that something is currently being done, for any number of reasons
- they approach a problem from first principles and accidentally/incidentally come up with a better way, sometimes because the playing field has changed or more/better supporting technologies have become available since the last time someone worked out the best way of doing it
- they figure there might be a buck in it
- they're bored
- they're determined to succeed, for selfish or altruistic reasons
- lots of other possibilities


And, of course, in the Whateley Universe, because:

THEY SAID I WAS MAD! BUT I'LL SHOW THEM! I'LL SHOW THEM ALL! BWA-HA-HAH!!!


Helpfully,
Diane

"WHO has deactivated my BEAUTIFUL frogs?"
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38244 is a reply to message #38231 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 14:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Faraway is currently offline Faraway
Messages: 1105
Registered: January 2009
Location: Russia
MitchellTF wrote on Sat, 02 May 2009 22:42

Sorry, good. Agh.

*rubs head* I keep misspeaking. A lot. I meant my question to be rhetorical.

"By what standard is 'war ceasing' good?"
Anyone take a guess? Wink

Never mind, I'm just a guy.

Eldritch: “Details, details, no pokey the cranky bitch.”
Bladedancer: “But Hekate’s not here!”
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38250 is a reply to message #38237 ] Sat, 02 May 2009 15:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Violet is currently offline Violet
Messages: 368
Registered: July 2008
Diane Castle wrote on Sat, 02 May 2009 13:26


And, of course, in the Whateley Universe, because:

THEY SAID I WAS MAD! BUT I'LL SHOW THEM! I'LL SHOW THEM ALL! BWA-HA-HAH!!!


or

Reason? Who needs a reason! I'm doing this For Science!!!

Dilbert: You were always a great hero of mine
Leonardo da Vinci: Is that so?
Dilbert: Yes I tried to model my carea after yours: Engineer, inventor, artist
Leonardo da Vinci: No no no, those were all sidelines, I am at heart a businessman
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38291 is a reply to message #38237 ] Sun, 03 May 2009 02:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bookworm is currently offline Bookworm
Messages: 1576
Registered: July 2008
Location: Houston
Diane Castle wrote on Sat, 02 May 2009 12:26


THEY SAID I WAS MAD! BUT I'LL SHOW THEM! I'LL SHOW THEM ALL! BWA-HA-HAH!!!



Diane forgot her medicine again, and the Muse has gone bi-polar!

RUN!!!!
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38295 is a reply to message #38291 ] Sun, 03 May 2009 02:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anvildude is currently offline Anvildude
Messages: 1927
Registered: November 2008
Stand back everyone, I'm going to try SCIENCE!!
.%%
.|.|
/__\
***

It's a sad thing when your paraphrase is longer than the original quote. Survivor of the Great Crash of 2011
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38298 is a reply to message #38295 ] Sun, 03 May 2009 02:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James K is currently offline James K
Messages: 529
Registered: January 2009
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
Anvildude wrote on Sun, 03 May 2009 18:35

Stand back everyone, I'm going to try SCIENCE!!
.%%
.|.|
/__\
***


XKCD FTW!

First Lesson: Every princess needs a battleaxe
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Re: Chou Lee [message #38305 is a reply to message #399 ] Sun, 03 May 2009 02:56 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Bladedancer is currently offline Bladedancer
Messages: 1160
Registered: January 2005
Location: Tennessee
That's absolutely lovely.

"...or I swear by my pretty floral bonnet that I will end you." Captain Malcolm Reynolds, Firefly.

My LJ name is poetheather. Come, read, enjoy?
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