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Re: Loose Cannons [message #56123 is a reply to message #56095 ] Thu, 29 March 2012 23:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sir Lee  is currently offline Sir Lee
Messages: 3110
Registered: May 2005
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Cockle wrote on Thu, 29 March 2012 12:15
Like how did it come about that WA had this somewhat controversial policy, and what else might that lead to?


"How come" is known. It was one of the new things Carson established during her early "temporary" tenure. Grossly simplifying things, she saw a need for it, she established this policy, it worked despite ideologues' objections, so it continues.


Don't call me Shirley. You will surely make me surly.
--
Sent from my Bugs Industries® bPhone™
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56135 is a reply to message #55485 ] Fri, 30 March 2012 18:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mittfh  is currently offline mittfh
Messages: 780
Registered: May 2011
Location: Kenilworth, UK

As with anywhere that contains an approximate cross-section of society, there are going to be people with prejudices - and the number of people prejudiced against LGBT* is fairly significant (especially in the US where a significant portion of the population are very conservative).

Now imagine a High School for superpowered individuals, and the potential they could have for causing serious injury to someone they didn't like...

Add onto that the fact that many LGBT* are that way as a result of their manifestation rather than being born that way, so may not be familiar with LGBT* issues etc.

They're also teenagers, so are (a) likely to behave less than rationally and (b) not be entirely discreet about their relationships.

So having a separate dorm for LGBT* is a mechanism to afford some protection for the students; allows them a safe environment to discuss issues / pursue relationships without outsiders looking in; and offers them a mutual support network.

Note, however, that there are also other conditions for entry to Poe: the LGBT* is the primary topic of concern (as opposed to GSD, for example); and they are relatively passable as a 'normal' human (because Poe wasn't initially connected to the tunnel network, which affords cross-campus travel on non green flag days - although since it now has a connection this requirement could probably be waived).

Further protection is offered by Poe's cover story - providing a convenient excuse for any odd behaviour by the residents.

The conditions also apply to those who change whilst at Whateley - to date those we've seen have coped fairly well with switching sides (with the exception of Jobe, but then he brought his own fate upon himself - both with the serum and who he was foolish enough to turn to for help...). No doubt if someone was having issues with their mid-term transformation, it would be obvious to the campus as a whole; so as long as they were judged to be in no significant danger of revealing the secret, they could potentially be transferred to Poe.
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56136 is a reply to message #55485 ] Fri, 30 March 2012 20:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dpragan  is currently offline dpragan
Messages: 3228
Registered: December 2008
Location: Texas
I find myself agreeing with mittfh on this particular concept.

People like to argue shoulda's but they should be more careful of what-is's.

The reason people freak out at L/G is because on an instinctual level male•female is the way of creating the next generation.

Also if someone (Person B) of the same gender are attracted to, say Person A, it might trigger an instinctive reaction in Person A that they are not living up to the biological ideal of their gender.

TG gets even more confusing.

Training can only go so far when it comes to visceral-instinctive reactions.



~Despite what they say, reality is in the eyes of the beholder, and therefore up for grabs!
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56145 is a reply to message #56136 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 06:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nekoali  is currently offline nekoali
Messages: 206
Registered: June 2011
No, I don't buy that, not at all. If you take a bunch of young kids who haven't learned that 'gay is bad' or whatever yet and introduce them to the idea, they don't care. It isn't until people start teaching their kids that 'such and such is bad' that they start to think that. Be it directly teaching them or by example.

Hatred and bigotry are learned behaviors, not instinctive. There are no gay hate crimes in the animal kingdom.
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56146 is a reply to message #56145 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 07:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James K  is currently offline James K
Messages: 529
Registered: January 2009
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
nekoali wrote on Sat, 31 March 2012 23:55
Hatred and bigotry are learned behaviors, not instinctive. There are no gay hate crimes in the animal kingdom.


History doesn't bear this out, for humans anyway. The desire to destroy that which is different to you is unfortunately very natural.


First Lesson: Every princess needs a battleaxe
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56148 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 07:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dpragan  is currently offline dpragan
Messages: 3228
Registered: December 2008
Location: Texas
Also by High school they are nearly adults and have already made up their minds, the grades you are referring to is K-3.

And even there, male kids would pick on kids they saw as smaller. while boys couldn't get away with it with girls they can do so on smaller boys.

Not to mention girls would ostracize other girls for being too much like yucky boys.

Some things are instinctive, I'm not saying it's a good thing or bad thing, but it's the reality of the world.

My personal belief is God likes to shake things up from time to time.

[Updated on: Sat, 31 March 2012 11:08]



~Despite what they say, reality is in the eyes of the beholder, and therefore up for grabs!
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56151 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 10:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Nicky82  is currently offline Nicky82
Messages: 1409
Registered: May 2011
Shouldn't this discussion be moved to a Poe cottage thread?

It's interesting and it shouldn't be given up, but it has definitely derailed the discussion from the intended topic.
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56164 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 20:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OmegaII  is currently offline OmegaII
Messages: 72
Registered: June 2011
Nekoali, while I can see where you are coming from, I think you missed one important detail. ALL the cottages are segregated by type( Whitman-girls GSD, Twain- boys GSD, Poe- LBGT, Melvile- money/socially powerful, Hawthorne- dangerous to self and others...). Poe is just the only one with a cover story due to past history of unified violence against them.


“Hey Razor, how's it hanging?” - Caitlin "Down, a little to the left and hard to carry." - Razorback “Razor says hi.” - Jericho "No I didn't you prankaholic nerdboy. I said my balls were lopsided. Get it straight." -Razorback
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56170 is a reply to message #56164 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nekoali  is currently offline nekoali
Messages: 206
Registered: June 2011
The problem isn't that they have a separate cottage for the LGBT kids. It is that they tell them and expect them to keep it a secret. Nobody tells the Whitman girls they have to hide being female.. yet violence against women is even more common than LGBT people. And the cottage is set up in a way that it self polices itself. Anybody who blows the cover for the cottage is going to be in deep trouble. Though a number of people have come out or been highly suspected...

And there are plenty of examples of LGBT kids in other cottages... some came out/transformed mid term, others hid it from the school so the faculty didn't know to put them in Poe, like Saladin, Diamondback and Razor...

A cottage for LGBT kids is a good idea. The bad idea is telling them that being LGBT is shameful, dangerous and should be hidden, which is what the secrecy around the cottage strongly enforces.

I agree though, we should take this conversation to a new thread and stop derailing this one...
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56171 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sat, 31 March 2012 22:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sir Lee  is currently offline Sir Lee
Messages: 3110
Registered: May 2005
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
I'm answering the above in the Poe's Secret thread over in the Poe Cottage area.

[Updated on: Sat, 31 March 2012 23:12]


Don't call me Shirley. You will surely make me surly.
--
Sent from my Bugs Industries® bPhone™
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56190 is a reply to message #56171 ] Sun, 01 April 2012 05:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Niknokitueu
Messages: 668
Registered: May 2011
Location: Swansea, UK
Sir Lee wrote on Sun, 01 April 2012 03:40
I'm answering the above in the Poe's Secret thread over in the Poe Cottage area.

I suggest anyone with an LGBT Poe opinion does likewise.

Now... Back to more Cannonical Looseness...?

Have Fun!
Niknokitueu


Do, or Do Not. There is no Try.
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56207 is a reply to message #56190 ] Sun, 01 April 2012 10:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mittfh  is currently offline mittfh
Messages: 780
Registered: May 2011
Location: Kenilworth, UK

Niknokitueu wrote on Sun, 01 April 2012 10:24
Sir Lee wrote on Sun, 01 April 2012 03:40
I'm answering the above in the Poe's Secret thread over in the Poe Cottage area.

I suggest anyone with an LGBT Poe opinion does likewise.

Now... Back to more Cannonical Looseness...?



Hopefully the thread will pick up again on more storyline-based discussion when the next part is posted - either tomorrow (counting today's fool as an extra), next week ('rolling over' from this week), the week after (if Diane decides today counts as the week gap between Ayla chapters), or even later (if one of the other authors has something to post - not that we mind The Bek & Diane Show in any way, shape or form Very Happy)

[Updated on: Sun, 01 April 2012 10:09]

Re: Loose Cannons [message #56777 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sun, 15 April 2012 05:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dmcarnegie  is currently offline dmcarnegie
Messages: 21
Registered: April 2008
Location: Eastern Washington
OH boy did the fecal matter hit the oscilating rotation device! I think one of them has to be a probability warper of some kind as things keep going south and north at the same time. No word on dear old dad if he is alive or not. I suspect dead but one never knows. This is too much fun to read! Good word and awaiting more!


"The Black Knight always Triumphs."-The Black Knight-Monty Python and the Holy Grail
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56778 is a reply to message #56777 ] Sun, 15 April 2012 06:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
oljak.eru  is currently offline oljak.eru
Messages: 1341
Registered: December 2008
Well, didn't Bek say something about this story intending to show that not everybody got to Whateley whole and healthy? Aside from the kids who died in part one, we have one of the protagonists down now, one of the parents down, and both the authorities and the bad guys after them. All they need now is for some overzealous superhero to get trigger happy, and the DPA to get involved, to have *everybody* against them.


“I am SO level-headed! And anyone who says different is going to have to answer to... The CABBIT OF DOOM!” -Jade
Re: Loose Cannons [message #56779 is a reply to message #55485 ] Sun, 15 April 2012 07:11 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
xenondestroyer  is currently offline xenondestroyer
Messages: 16
Registered: March 2012
Location: italy-sardinia
one of them is a probability warper, period. won't believe anything else about that.

I'd just like to know why every time the people in charge won't admit their errors, trying instead to cover their asses...
you'd think they would learn it doesn't work in the end, don't you? Rolling Eyes


xenondestroyer because armed with an m5 pirate mandalay i destroyed an m2 xenon K.
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