Home » The Crystal Hall » Questions and Answers » The Internet and England
| Re: The Internet and England [message #46211 is a reply to message #46208 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 11:06   |
 Laudator
Messages: 935
Registered: February 2009 |
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| XaltatunOfAcheron wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 15:48 | | Laudator wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 08:18 | By Godwin's Law, I declare this thread over!
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That's BS and you know it.
Godwin's Law applies when someone starts calling someone else a Nazi, etc. That hasn't happened here. In any case, it's the moderator's duty to take care of these things. I don't see that you've been declared to be a moderator.
Xaltatun
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Calm down, calm down!
Yes, I know that my post was not literally true.
But since there have been comparisons to Hitler and Nazis on this thread, neither is your response.
As for moderators, I hesitate to tell them what their job is.
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46212 is a reply to message #46211 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 11:19 |
XaltatunOfAcheron
Messages: 1930
Registered: July 2005
Location: Atlantis |
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| Laudator wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 09:06 | | XaltatunOfAcheron wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 15:48 | | Laudator wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 08:18 | By Godwin's Law, I declare this thread over!
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That's BS and you know it.
Godwin's Law applies when someone starts calling someone else a Nazi, etc. That hasn't happened here. In any case, it's the moderator's duty to take care of these things. I don't see that you've been declared to be a moderator.
Xaltatun
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Calm down, calm down!
Yes, I know that my post was not literally true.
But since there have been comparisons to Hitler and Nazis on this thread, neither is your response.
As for moderators, I hesitate to tell them what their job is.
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When there are forum moderators, it's their business to moderate, based on whatever criteria they find reasonable. As you point out, it's neither my nor your business to tell them their job.
Invoking a total misreading of "Godwin's Law" to stop a thread just because a couple of words, used in an entirely appropriate historical context, happens to offend you, is arrogating the moderator's privilege to yourself.
That bit of officiousness is what offended me.
You're not one of the moderators. E.E. Nalley is. If EE finds that the thread needs to be stopped, I'm sure he'll say so.
Xaltatun
Oxymoron: Jumbo Shrimp
Impossible: Sustainable Growth
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46213 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 11:25 |
Laudator
Messages: 935
Registered: February 2009 |
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I decline to escalate further.
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46218 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 13:07 |
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E. E. Nalley
Messages: 603
Registered: July 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA |
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Well, we haven't quite gotten to the moderation point and, with a bit of civility all around I don't think we will. I'm actually quite pleased how well this conversation has been handled so far.
[/moderator]
It is somewhat ironic that people look at invocation of rights (constitutional, human or otherwise) as an extreme or absolute position. Really and truly for them to be a right they rather have to be absolute as the moment you need permission for something what you have is a privilege, not a right.
However, the Founding Fathers of the USA had in mind a 'limitation' if you will of how far free speech would be allowed and, I personally don't think they really imagined it would ever fall out of fashion the way it did. That is the personal duel of honor. One could spout whatever one felt needed to be made public so long as they were willing to put their body and mortal life on the line for it. You never knew when you'd get a white glove to the face and that is likely one of the reasons that society was so polite and civil. Their language, strange to our ears now, was actually quite precise and absolute in it's meanings of words to discourage misunderstandings that could lead to duels.
Now, am I advocating a repeal of anti-dueling laws? I don't know that I'd go that far. I'm not entirely sure that this society with it's vague and informal language rife with double and triple entendre; not to mention colloquial 'jive' where words are actually used in the opposite of their dictionary meanings, could survive such a repeal. I don't think that 'the streets would run with blood' as my liberal friends like to employ whenever a new state in the Union contemplates relaxing of it's pistol carry laws.
Sadly, and this will sound terribly elite of me so please forgive me if offense is found in what I'm about to say, but honestly I don't feel society as a whole is educated sufficiently to even properly define honor, let alone defend it.
Be a dreamer who DOES, not a dreamer who dreams!
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46222 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 14:50 |
khade
Messages: 1585
Registered: May 2011
Location: Rockies |
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We've survived many invocations of Godwin's law, though the crash did remove many of them, I'm confidant that we will survive many more. I think one of the Ayla threads actually invoked it at least 20 times, over the course of 200 pages.
Actually, American freedom of speech limits are difficult to determine, but in general, if you are infringing on someone else's rights, you are breaking the law. Doesn't mean you will get in trouble for it, but you could.
Edit
Oh, and the Westboro Baptist Church breaks it on all kinds of levels, slander, harassment and being public nuisances probably being the easiest to define.
[Updated on: Sun, 02 October 2011 14:52]
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46224 is a reply to message #46218 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 14:58 |
mn--
Messages: 130
Registered: May 2011
Location: Finland |
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| E. E. Nalley wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 20:07 |
Sadly, and this will sound terribly elite of me so please forgive me if offense is found in what I'm about to say, but honestly I don't feel society as a whole is educated sufficiently to even properly define honor, let alone defend it.
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Besides, there's a bunch of different subsets of this "society as a whole" that do within themselves have an internally consistent definition of honor, it's just that they'd disagree with each other... possibly violently.
Not surprisingly, these are often the same groupings that have the same problem with free speech.
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46228 is a reply to message #46192 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 15:45 |
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Diane Castle
Messages: 2505
Registered: September 2007
Location: Oregon, USA |
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| Elaborate wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 01:58 | Yeah, I think it's a bit sad; free speech is important, even if people abuse it.
As Tailsteak put it:
| Quote: | When Phelps is finally hauled off to the loony bin and/or gulag, we can all panic for our rights, but until that day, rejoice! You want to see how free our speech is? It's this free, my friends. If you head out to Topeka, Kansas, you can say crap up to and including this offensive.
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It's why I felt a slight twinge of melancholy when that twerp Trollo finally got his offensive behind banned (again). The guy illustrated so well where the outer limits of permissible behavior went...
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Unfortunately, Trollo also knew how to step over the line, and he said some things to Warren that Warren took very personally. Deliberately pissing off the guy who controls your access, after said person already warned you that you were on your last strike? Not a smart choice. Personally, I think Trollo committed suicide by moderator.
Diane
"WHO has deactivated my BEAUTIFUL frogs?"
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46235 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 19:20 |
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Cockle
Messages: 646
Registered: July 2011
Location: UK |
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Am I the only one who thought Laudator was just trying to be witty? (Evidently with mixed results.)
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46239 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 19:35 |
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ShinZed
Messages: 155
Registered: May 2011
Location: UK |
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I fail to see what this argument has to do with England's internet. Basically, it's slower than you'd expect it given what they tell you but you can probably find anything you want so long as you're savvy enough (everything mutant is hidden behind a .mut address).
Drop the RL free speech stuff, it's needless drama that we don't need.
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46242 is a reply to message #46221 ] |
Sun, 02 October 2011 20:19 |
kd7mvs
Messages: 668
Registered: March 2009
Location: Tacoma, WA |
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| Coral wrote on Sun, 02 October 2011 11:47 | | thejackle123 wrote on Fri, 23 September 2011 05:53 | I am writing some fiction in the Whateleyverse set in England and I was woundering if there was anything cannon as to the state of things in England that I would need to know. Can someone also tell me how much usefull information could be found on the internet by the average Joe?
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I believe Sara's origin involved Europe, so you might check the early stories there.
Though it may have just been a few phrases and English supers throwing me off, so ymmv
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Nope, Sara's an Aussie, started out there before shooting over to ARC.
Nikki Reilly: Sidhe who must be obeyed!
Goodkind International, The Good Ideas People™
Information wants to be free, and I will be the one who frees it! - Psike
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46661 is a reply to message #46001 ] |
Wed, 12 October 2011 19:14 |
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mittfh
Messages: 764
Registered: May 2011
Location: Kenilworth, UK |
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As for registration:
a) go to your local Shire Hall or library - most councils seem to be repurposing libraries / bits of the town/county hall as "hubs" - places where you can go to access all county / district council services, make council-related enquiries etc. My local one's also moving in the police front desk, post office and library, with a social care "Local Delivery Centre" (both adults and children's) around the corner.
b) phone someone up at a call centre - they'll ask you the questions, fill in the form at their end, then post the completed form to you to check and sign.
c) fill it in over the web.
Although officialdom would probably hassle you less than the MCO in the US, you'd have to contend with the likes of the Daily Wail (editorial policy akin to Chicken Licken) and red-tops (tabloids, gutter press,bigger circulation than the serious papers put together) using pseudo-science and inflammatory language to try and prejudice people against mutants. Although occasionally, particularly if the mutant they were focussing on was a high level female physical exemplar, they'd suddenly adopt the reverse stance. I wonder why...
For the nearest 'real world' analogues, look at their coverage of immigrants (too many / can't speak the language / making no effort to integrate / stealing jobs from natives / scrounging benefits and housing etc.) and LGBT issues (Can! You! Say! Sensationalism!?).
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| Re: The Internet and England [message #46677 is a reply to message #46661 ] |
Thu, 13 October 2011 03:44 |
Niknokitueu
Messages: 649
Registered: May 2011
Location: Swansea, UK |
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| mittfh wrote on Thu, 13 October 2011 00:14 | (Can! You! Say! Sensationalism!?).
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Yes! We! Can!
(Sorry, just channeled Bob the Builder...)
Have Fun!
Niknokitueu
Do, or Do Not. There is no Try.
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