Home » The Crystal Hall » Character Discussions » Stacy aka Silver Ghost (Silver Linings)
| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52068 is a reply to message #52053 ] |
Fri, 20 January 2012 15:42   |
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 dpragan
Messages: 3166
Registered: December 2008
Location: Texas |
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| Sojiro wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 10:37 | | awjs wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 15:58 | I am pretty sure that Stacy has a small amount of telepathy so she should get the TP rating.
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What does TP means? And yes, she definitely has mind reading abilities, see above (the royal blue entries to be specific).
| awjs wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 15:58 | I am in the group thinking she is an EX/PDP, and a rare one at that since she can use her ESP and possibly TP while she has her PK-field up. I refer you to the time she was running from that superhero (the cat one) through the train yard and seem to just know which way the hero was planning on cutting her off, it wasn't a paragon trait because if it was I doubt she would of ended up at a dead-end needing to learn how to fly to get away.
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The reason it doesn't look like Paragon is that she was not doing some awesome evasive running moves and otherwise showing off incredible skill, she just knew where to go. Making one mistake out of dozens of choices just means it's not absolutely 100% reliable.
And this is an example I discuss above. There are a couple ways to explain how she used that ESP power while fleeing.
| dpragan wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 16:34 | Might be reading too much into the PK shell's coloring is all. (Man 1 at most unless the PK shell is really a Man one)
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Yeah, you are. A silver field is just a type of PK field (like Hank's) which reflects lights like a metal instead of being transparent. That's no different from Mirror's PK-field. This is pure PK, no Manifestor trait needed for that.
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Dunno Mega-Girl is PK/Man Mix, It might just be a PK field visual or it might be something more since she can make it so that she is pulling a Predator Cloak.
~Despite what they say, reality is in the eyes of the beholder, and therefore up for grabs!
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52069 is a reply to message #52068 ] |
Fri, 20 January 2012 15:53 |
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Sojiro
Messages: 1652
Registered: November 2011 |
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| dpragan wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 21:42 |
Dunno Mega-Girl is PK/Man Mix, It might just be a PK field visual or it might be something more since she can make it so that she is pulling a Predator Cloak.
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If you actually pay attention to the link you gave, you'll notice that Mega-Girl is NOT a Man/PK mix. She's a Man-4:a, with no PK power. The PK-shell power is classified as purely Man, and not PK, unlike what the name suggests. It is a specific power encasing the user in a manifested form, while PK-bricks simply wrap a force-field around their normal self. Those are different powers.
While I understand the confusion, a skin-tight silver field of PK just like Mirror's or Pearlescent is a purely PK power, and distinct from the Manifested PK-shell.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52074 is a reply to message #52069 ] |
Fri, 20 January 2012 16:51 |
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dpragan
Messages: 3166
Registered: December 2008
Location: Texas |
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| Sojiro wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 14:53 | | dpragan wrote on Fri, 20 January 2012 21:42 |
Dunno Mega-Girl is PK/Man Mix, It might just be a PK field visual or it might be something more since she can make it so that she is pulling a Predator Cloak.
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If you actually pay attention to the link you gave, you'll notice that Mega-Girl is NOT a Man/PK mix. She's a Man-4:a, with no PK power. The PK-shell power is classified as purely Man, and not PK, unlike what the name suggests. It is a specific power encasing the user in a manifested form, while PK-bricks simply wrap a force-field around their normal self. Those are different powers.
While I understand the confusion, a skin-tight silver field of PK just like Mirror's or Pearlescent is a purely PK power, and distinct from the Manifested PK-shell.
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I'll grant you on Mega-Girl, but SG is MORE then just silver she can turn invisible(easiest way is an optical camouflage).
I'm not saying she is or isn't, just to NOT rule it out.
~Despite what they say, reality is in the eyes of the beholder, and therefore up for grabs!
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52079 is a reply to message #52019 ] |
Fri, 20 January 2012 18:35 |
 khade
Messages: 1579
Registered: May 2011
Location: Rockies |
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OK, so I guess I need to explain my reasoning for my levels, and I can agree with the 4 being too high, but I still think her mental exemplar level is pretty high.
So I said PDP with other knacks, by which I mean separate abilities that are psychic but aren't part of the PDP, foremost being Paragon and the toggleable TK brick package. Before I go on, I need to state that Paragon does not mean that you are good at everything, and that you have the skill needed to do what you know how to do, what it gives the user is the capacity to be instinctively good at 'what they set out to be good at', but it doesn't give the athleticism or muscle memory to pull off Matrix style moves. It also doesn't help you if you don't actually listen to the instinct.
So, Stacy likely spends most of that power being convincingly female, but when she panics, she stops doing that and starts worrying exclusively on how to get out of whatever situation is making her panic, which allows the power to assist her until she stops panicking and starts worrying about getting caught again. It isn't a very strong Paragon trait, it can lead her in wrong directions, but it's allowed her to survive.
The reasoning on why the TK brick thing is separate is that she can use it and still use other powers, which as has been said before, as far as we know can't be done. Cavalier could do things that look like he's using all 3 parts of his PDP, but he was actually taking advantage of a delay in the effects wearing off, and switching rapidly, and that's the closest we've seen a verified PDP get to using multiple powers at the same time, at least that I can remember.
On the mental Exemplar thing, I never did say that it would allow her to read people's minds, I said it could allow her to read people, as in body language. combining a good eye and good understanding of how people work in different situations, some people have the capacity to tell lots of things about people just by watching them, that would be the part most easily fooled by the bullshit artist act, combine it with a psychic ability to read sincerity, and a person who can convince themselves of anything could fool the user of those two as long as said user isn't actively tracking the underlying emotions and ideas behind the eyes and mind.
A high level exemplar doesn't have to have eidetic memory or direction sense or time sense, and it doesn't mean they will be smarter then anyone else, it just means they think faster, and differently then usual, in this case, I'm suggesting the danger sense, the reading thing I'm currently a fan of, and the fact that she understands better and thinks clearer most of the time to indicate a decent amount of mental exemplar.
Though thinking about it, I guess she could easily be a high Exemplar 3 or a low Exemplar 4.
I think TP is telepath, by they way.
I could be wrong about some or all of this, I suppose.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52111 is a reply to message #52074 ] |
Sat, 21 January 2012 04:04 |
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greyman
Messages: 222
Registered: May 2011 |
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| dpragan wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 07:51 | I'll grant you on Mega-Girl, but SG is MORE then just silver she can turn invisible(easiest way is an optical camouflage).
I'm not saying she is or isn't, just to NOT rule it out.
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Bending light--for reflection or psuedo-transparency--can still come under Psychokinesis. In fact, I'd say it's more likely to be PK than Manifestation.
It's also possible to do it with an Energiser field (see Wallflower). There is some blurring between the 'kinetic, manifestation, and energisation power sets.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52115 is a reply to message #52079 ] |
Sat, 21 January 2012 11:06 |
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Sojiro
Messages: 1652
Registered: November 2011 |
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| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | Before I go on, I need to state that Paragon does not mean that you are good at everything
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Actually that's precisely what it does.
| Quote: | and that you have the skill needed to do what you know how to do
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That's correct, it works by giving instinctual knowledge of the movements and actions to make, it doesn't infuse skill inside the user.
| Quote: | what it gives the user is the capacity to be instinctively good at 'what they set out to be good at', but it doesn't give the athleticism or muscle memory to pull off Matrix style moves.
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Muscle memory is not relevant here (since it's not used), and the athleticism comes from the Exemplar rating.
So, Stacy likely spends most of that power being convincingly female[/quote]Wait, what? That doesn't even make sense.
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | but when she panics, she stops doing that and starts worrying exclusively on how to get out of whatever situation is making her panic, which allows the power to assist her until she stops panicking and starts worrying about getting caught again.
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That would explain how she suddenly learned to fly. It works differently than it did for Mimeo (who saw how things were done, which isn't Stacy's case) but that could simply be because those are different versions.
She could also have suddenly discovered it the same way most mutant discover their powers, they don't all have a Paragon directing them.
Occam's Razor say that this is not a Paragon trait, since it could just as well be the "dowsing" at work again, and that she definitely showed off that one".
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 |
The reasoning on why the TK brick thing is separate is that she can use it and still use other powers, which as has been said before, as far as we know can't be done.
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OK, first there are several ways she could have done that as I've said and repeated. Next, it is not impossible. Actually it has been stated as definitely possible, for a powerful PDP. Which Stacy would be, being a TG.
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | Cavalier could do things that look like he's using all 3 parts of his PDP, but he was actually taking advantage of a delay in the effects wearing off, and switching rapidly
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Creating a persistent PK effect, then switching to ESP (or Psy) to get a quick flash of insight, and then back to PK before it can start to unravel, yes. Judicator does the same. And Stacy could have done the same too. There are also several other explanations for that.
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | and that's the closest we've seen a verified PDP get to using multiple powers at the same time, at least that I can remember.
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Then you should pay more attention to FUBAR. He routinely uses PK+clairvoyance, for example.
I'll conclude saying that you don't need to have both the PK and the Paragon trait has separate knacks from the PDP power to use them both together, just one of them being separate and the other coming from the PDP would be enough. Saying that they're both independent from the rest of the power is completely unnecessary complication.
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | On the mental Exemplar thing, I never did say that it would allow her to read people's minds, I said it could allow her to read people, as in body language.
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1) There has never been a single hint saying that exemplar allows to read body language
2) Stacy does not read body language, she gets unfathomable insight that she instinctively knows are reliable
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | A high level exemplar doesn't have to have eidetic memory or direction sense or time sense, and it doesn't mean they will be smarter then anyone else
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If he doesn't have the mental package? Sure. If he does, he will have eidetic memory. The various senses are indeed optional, though.
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | it just means they think faster, and differently then usual
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Nope. better memory and mental calculation are the only base difference, as the authors have repeated multiple times. Not that I completely agree with that anyway...
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | in this case, I'm suggesting the danger sense, the reading thing I'm currently a fan of, and the fact that she understands better and thinks clearer most of the time to indicate a decent amount of mental exemplar.
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1) she shows the danger sense all of once, and it doesn't show up several time when she was in danger, so it is extremely unlikely to be part of the exemplar package
2) "a decent amount" is not 5+, that would give her better memorization and reading capabilities than Ayla. From what has been said (see above) she does NOT have that level of mental capabilities. So low Ex-4 max in mental capabilities1
| khade wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 00:35 | Though thinking about it, I guess she could easily be a high Exemplar 3 or a low Exemplar 4.
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That's precisely what I said from the start, so I'll just say "yes, I agree".
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52136 is a reply to message #52111 ] |
Sat, 21 January 2012 14:19 |
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dpragan
Messages: 3166
Registered: December 2008
Location: Texas |
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| greyman wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 03:04 | | dpragan wrote on Sat, 21 January 2012 07:51 | I'll grant you on Mega-Girl, but SG is MORE then just silver she can turn invisible(easiest way is an optical camouflage).
I'm not saying she is or isn't, just to NOT rule it out.
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Bending light--for reflection or psuedo-transparency--can still come under Psychokinesis. In fact, I'd say it's more likely to be PK than Manifestation.
It's also possible to do it with an Energiser field (see Wallflower). There is some blurring between the 'kinetic, manifestation, and energisation power sets.
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All I'm saying, is to not rule anything out.
[Updated on: Sat, 21 January 2012 14:19]
~Despite what they say, reality is in the eyes of the beholder, and therefore up for grabs!
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52171 is a reply to message #52019 ] |
Sun, 22 January 2012 03:12 |
khade
Messages: 1579
Registered: May 2011
Location: Rockies |
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I'm pretty sure Paragon only works on what you are trying to do, if you aren't focusing on it, you can't do it, but you may be right on the not needing both to be separate knacks. On the Fubar thing, I do remember a conversation where we talked about this, and I think it was Diane Castle that mentioned that he actually manifests the body, and they still haven't given an example of someone capable of using more then one PDP skill at once, and refuse to state whether it is impossible to do so, but heavily imply that it is. I guess Fubar might be the closest we've seen, but he is an absurdly powerful psychic, I'm pretty sure he's supposed to be the strongest in the world, or at least very close to it.
The body language thing is something normal humans can learn to do, no reason why it can't be an exemplar trait.
With the quick switching thing that PDPs can sometimes do, I'm pretty sure it's very hard and few, if any of them start out with the capacity to do so.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52187 is a reply to message #52171 ] |
Sun, 22 January 2012 09:00 |
amratner
Messages: 271
Registered: January 2012
Location: NH, US |
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| khade wrote on Sun, 22 January 2012 03:12 | On the Fubar thing, I do remember a conversation where we talked about this, and I think it was Diane Castle that mentioned that he actually manifests the body, and they still haven't given an example of someone capable of using more then one PDP skill at once, and refuse to state whether it is impossible to do so, but heavily imply that it is. I guess Fubar might be the closest we've seen, but he is an absurdly powerful psychic, I'm pretty sure he's supposed to be the strongest in the world, or at least very close to it.
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Is Fubar a PDP? He is described as a very powerful psychic, but I do not recall his ever being classed as a PDP. I thought that he has telepathy, telekinesis, and several other psychic powers, all usable at once.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52188 is a reply to message #52187 ] |
Sun, 22 January 2012 09:03 |
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Sojiro
Messages: 1652
Registered: November 2011 |
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| amratner wrote on Sun, 22 January 2012 15:00 | Is Fubar a PDP?
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yes. He's even quoted as an example of the rare Exemplar+PDP combo.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52246 is a reply to message #52019 ] |
Sun, 22 January 2012 19:19 |
khade
Messages: 1579
Registered: May 2011
Location: Rockies |
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Here's Fubars Wiki page.
I'm thinking that we don't have enough information to continue our discussion, yet.
It looks like most people agree on the Silver Ghost being a PDP of an unknown strength, Exemplar 3 with some unknown about of mental boosts, which might just be from the changed environment, and maybe has a separate PKish brick package of an unknown type.
Does that work for everyone for now?
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52274 is a reply to message #52019 ] |
Mon, 23 January 2012 04:56 |
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Sojiro
Messages: 1652
Registered: November 2011 |
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Given how useful Stacy's ESP powers are in a fight (like spotting that Danny was going to fire thanks to her empathy) and that we only have a single example of combining anything with the PK power (which might not even be that), it is not really reasonable to say that this is the power which is accessible outside the PDP.
The dowsing/paragon ESP would make more sense.
But given how rare it is to see something that even remotely looks like using two powers, it might just be a "plain" Exemplar PDP.
As for ratings, something along the lines of (ESP-2 / Psy-1~2 / PK-4~5), even though the ESP from PDP is apparently not rated the same way as it is when it's on its own, so it is difficult to say precisely.
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52300 is a reply to message #52246 ] |
Mon, 23 January 2012 12:49 |
amratner
Messages: 271
Registered: January 2012
Location: NH, US |
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| khade wrote on Sun, 22 January 2012 19:19 | Here's Fubars Wiki page.
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Well, we know Fub can use TK and telepathy at the same time.
Perhaps he couldn't originally (when he was a student and got his MID) but his power has increased over the years?
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| Re: Stacy aka Silver Ghost [message #52307 is a reply to message #52300 ] |
Mon, 23 January 2012 13:55 |
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Diane Castle
Messages: 2505
Registered: September 2007
Location: Oregon, USA |
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| amratner wrote on Mon, 23 January 2012 09:49 | | khade wrote on Sun, 22 January 2012 19:19 | Here's Fubars Wiki page.
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Well, we know Fub can use TK and telepathy at the same time.
Perhaps he couldn't originally (when he was a student and got his MID) but his power has increased over the years?
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Actually, we don't know that. Sorry. But the Foob does two things to make it look that way. One, he's also a manifestor, so he can fake the TK part for a bit. And two, he's extremely good at the 'PDP Flicker', where a PDP flicks over to the telepathy (or empathy or esper or precog or...) just long enough to get what's going on, and then flicks back to the PK (whether it's long range, short range, zero range, superboy, shell, or what have you) mode quickly enough that there isn't a significant degradation in the PK effect.
For most PDP's this takes a huge amount of training, and some PDP's never get the hang of it.
Diane
"WHO has deactivated my BEAUTIFUL frogs?"
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